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Do you play Lebensohl or reverse Leb, a transfer version, scramble, something else ?
Hand to follow
What methods do you play here ?
#1
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Posted 2022-September-14, 11:18
Do you play Lebensohl or reverse Leb, a transfer version, scramble, something else ?
Hand to follow
#2
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Posted 2022-September-14, 11:26
I play standard Lebensohl here
#3
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Posted 2022-September-14, 11:31
MP7601, on 2022-September-14, 11:26, said:
I play standard Lebensohl here
Where is the delineation between good and bad for the suit bids ? You've already denied enough to overcall. Do you do anything much different to over a 2nd seat double ?
#4
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Posted 2022-September-14, 12:33
I play the same version of Lebensohl in response to both a second- and fourth-seat double.
I thought I'd be a little more conservative opposite a balancing double but looking at my BBO records for 2020 and 2021 the auction has only come up twice and I jumped to game opposite the double both times
I thought I'd be a little more conservative opposite a balancing double but looking at my BBO records for 2020 and 2021 the auction has only come up twice and I jumped to game opposite the double both times
#5
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Posted 2022-September-14, 13:00
I play transfer Lebensohl here - or, more accurately, something very similar to Rubensohl. I would not play reverse Lebensohl. It is technically superior to regular Lebensohl in some situations, but worse in others, inferior to transfer versions and mixups are costly.
#6
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Posted 2022-September-14, 14:48
The hand in question is not a very likely one to hold (although the 2 passes are not a surprise) do you double ?
We play reverse leb, so partner would bid their suit.
What do you do over:
3♦ reverse leb, bad hand
2N normal leb
3♣? transfer
We play reverse leb, so partner would bid their suit.
What do you do over:
3♦ reverse leb, bad hand
2N normal leb
3♣? transfer
#7
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Posted 2022-September-14, 14:48
Cyberyeti, on 2022-September-14, 11:31, said:
Where is the delineation between good and bad for the suit bids ? You've already denied enough to overcall. Do you do anything much different to over a 2nd seat double ?
A 3level overcall requires both a good suit and a good hand, so while the pass limits the hand in some ways, by no means does it mean that advancer has to have a weak hand.
For me, 2N here would deny as much as a good eight count with a decent 5 card suit. Thus, by implication, a 3 level suit bid shows at least an eight count and a decent suit.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
#8
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Posted 2022-September-14, 15:16
mikeh, on 2022-September-14, 14:48, said:
A 3level overcall requires both a good suit and a good hand, so while the pass limits the hand in some ways, by no means does it mean that advancer has to have a weak hand.
For me, 2N here would deny as much as a good eight count with a decent 5 card suit. Thus, by implication, a 3 level suit bid shows at least an eight count and a decent suit.
For me, 2N here would deny as much as a good eight count with a decent 5 card suit. Thus, by implication, a 3 level suit bid shows at least an eight count and a decent suit.
OK, I asked the question because the double could actually be lighter than a second seat double if short in spades.
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
#9
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Posted 2022-September-14, 16:13
Cyberyeti, on 2022-September-14, 15:16, said:
OK, I asked the question because the double could actually be lighter than a second seat double if short in spades.
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
At the risk of sounding like a smartass ..it depends
It depends on the vulnerability. It depends on the specifics of my hand. It depends on the form of scoring, to a modest degree. It even depends, to another modest degree, on my partner.
Yes, the balancing double can be lighter than a direct double, and of course nobody can guarantee ending up in the right spot, but we do the best we can.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
#10
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Posted 2022-September-14, 22:14
Cyberyeti, on 2022-September-14, 11:18, said:
Do you play Lebensohl or reverse Leb, a transfer version, scramble, something else ?
Hand to follow
2NT herbert negative 0-7 point suit 4+suit 8+point double in 4th chaire can be with a void in spade
but with 2+♠ in direct seat
#11
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Posted 2022-September-15, 00:45
Cyberyeti, on 2022-September-14, 14:48, said:
The hand in question is not a very likely one to hold (although the 2 passes are not a surprise) do you double ?
We play reverse leb, so partner would bid their suit.
What do you do over:
3♦ reverse leb, bad hand
2N normal leb
3♣? transfer
We play reverse leb, so partner would bid their suit.
What do you do over:
3♦ reverse leb, bad hand
2N normal leb
3♣? transfer
Cyberyeti, on 2022-September-14, 15:16, said:
OK, I asked the question because the double could actually be lighter than a second seat double if short in spades.
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
#12
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Posted 2022-September-15, 01:52
Cyberyeti, on 2022-September-14, 15:16, said:
OK, I asked the question because the double could actually be lighter than a second seat double if short in spades.
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
NO I Double at worse i go under if partner have a Flat hand and Zero point and LHO PASS
so he must bid 2 NT and i bid 3 club and go down but opopnets have 26point and some game !
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Posted 2022-September-15, 02:28
Cyberyeti, on 2022-September-14, 15:16, said:
OK, I asked the question because the double could actually be lighter than a second seat double if short in spades.
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
Do you pass over 2♠ wih a 3235 14 count with an adequate club suit and ♠xxx ?
Assuming "pass over" means you are in second seat, then probably.
#14
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Posted 2022-September-15, 02:37
DavidKok, on 2022-September-15, 00:45, said:
3NT to play over the weak options (you could make a case for the perfect 7-opposite-26 making a nice slam but our spade length strongly suggests that the hands don't fit well), 3NT over 3♣ superaccept balanced, choice of games (and keeps 6♦ somewhat in the picture).
Do you expect partner to remove this with a very weak shapely hand ? 6 diamonds (43) in the non spade suits, one Q or K
How many diamonds have you shown with the superaccept ? What do you do with the same hand with ♥AKQ ♦AK ? Or indeed AKQ A AKxx in the non spade suits
#15
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Posted 2022-September-15, 04:01
I expect partner to run with a hand so weak it likely doesn't have an entry, or with extreme shape. The weak hand bids 5♦, the extreme shape one 4♦ (constructive). I'm never running from 3NT undoubled to 4m to play.
The superaccept only shows 2 diamonds, it was the wrong choice of words. Really it just shows a big balanced hand, too bid for 2NT 16-19. Balanced implies diamond tolerance but nothing more. The transfer shows some values for me, so at this point we're looking at 20+ balanced opposite 8+ with diamonds. I should probably have bid 4NT (natural) instead of 3NT over the transfer.
The superaccept only shows 2 diamonds, it was the wrong choice of words. Really it just shows a big balanced hand, too bid for 2NT 16-19. Balanced implies diamond tolerance but nothing more. The transfer shows some values for me, so at this point we're looking at 20+ balanced opposite 8+ with diamonds. I should probably have bid 4NT (natural) instead of 3NT over the transfer.
#16
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Posted 2022-September-15, 04:28
DavidKok, on 2022-September-15, 04:01, said:
I expect partner to run with a hand so weak it likely doesn't have an entry, or with extreme shape. The weak hand bids 5♦, the extreme shape one 4♦ (constructive). I'm never running from 3NT undoubled to 4m to play.
The superaccept only shows 2 diamonds, it was the wrong choice of words. Really it just shows a big balanced hand, too bid for 2NT 16-19. Balanced implies diamond tolerance but nothing more. The transfer shows some values for me, so at this point we're looking at 20+ balanced opposite 8+ with diamonds. I should probably have bid 4NT (natural) instead of 3NT over the transfer.
The superaccept only shows 2 diamonds, it was the wrong choice of words. Really it just shows a big balanced hand, too bid for 2NT 16-19. Balanced implies diamond tolerance but nothing more. The transfer shows some values for me, so at this point we're looking at 20+ balanced opposite 8+ with diamonds. I should probably have bid 4NT (natural) instead of 3NT over the transfer.
What do you do with the actual hand then (void, xxx, xxxxxx, K10xx) if the transfer shows values ? and how do you distinguish that from ♥QJx/♣xxxx ?
#17
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Posted 2022-September-15, 04:45
I bid 2NT weak, intending to bid 3♦ next. You don't distinguish between different weak hands, I'd run from 3NT with that.
#18
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Posted 2022-September-15, 06:06
DavidKok, on 2022-September-15, 04:45, said:
I bid 2NT weak, intending to bid 3♦ next. You don't distinguish between different weak hands, I'd run from 3NT with that.
It's a nasty hand particularly at MPs.
void, QJx, xxxxxx, xxxx you want to play 5♦
void, xxx, xxxxxx, Kxxx you want to play 3N or 6♦ the 109♣ is enough to make 6♦ best by a distance
void, xxx, J10xxxx, Kxxx and void QJx, J10xxxx, xxxx you want to play 6♦
On the actual hand 3N will make 12 by the big hand, 11 if you play normal Lebensohl and wrongside it, 5♦ will make 13 as clubs are 3-3, diamonds are 2-2 and the 2♠ bidder has ♣QJx
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Posted 2022-September-15, 06:33
mikeh, on 2022-September-14, 14:48, said:
A 3level overcall requires both a good suit and a good hand, so while the pass limits the hand in some ways, by no means does it mean that advancer has to have a weak hand.
For me, 2N here would deny as much as a good eight count with a decent 5 card suit. Thus, by implication, a 3 level suit bid shows at least an eight count and a decent suit.
For me, 2N here would deny as much as a good eight count with a decent 5 card suit. Thus, by implication, a 3 level suit bid shows at least an eight count and a decent suit.
I have the agreement with my partner that 2NT Lebensohl is Weak and we didn't add the requirement for 3-level call to have a good suit.
Are you doing this for both (2S)-DBL-(P)-? and (2S)-P-(P)-DBL-(P)-?
What do you bid with 4-card and not very weak or strong?
e.g. with: xx=AQxx=Qxxx=xxx or xx=Qxx=Qxxx=AQxx
#20
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Posted 2022-September-15, 06:57
kgr, on 2022-September-15, 06:33, said:
I have the agreement with my partner that 2NT Lebensohl is Weak and we didn't add the requirement for 3-level call to have a good suit.
Are you doing this for both (2S)-DBL-(P)-? and (2S)-P-(P)-DBL-(P)-?
What do you bid with 4-card and not very weak or strong?
e.g. with: xx=AQxx=Qxxx=xxx or xx=Qxx=Qxxx=AQxx
Are you doing this for both (2S)-DBL-(P)-? and (2S)-P-(P)-DBL-(P)-?
What do you bid with 4-card and not very weak or strong?
e.g. with: xx=AQxx=Qxxx=xxx or xx=Qxx=Qxxx=AQxx
not sure i got the question right
answering partner double or biding after 2 S?