[whereagles]

Imp pairs, expert field, you hold (all vuln)

♠ ---
♥ AQ93
♦ AKJ8742
♣ K10

Pard..RHO....you..LHO
pass..2♣* ..??

*Natural, weak 2 in clubs.

Playing natural methods after this opening, what do you bid?

[hrothgar]

Interesting hand, made more difficult because partner is a passed hand:

From my perspective, there are two bids worth considering

1. Double
2. 3♦

The advantage of double is that this gives you a chance to find a Heart contract. Admittedly, its not a great chance, but its a chance none-the-less. One possible auction would be

P - (2♣) - X - (P)
2♠ - (P) - 3♦ - (P)
3♥

The alternative is starting with a jump to 3♦

If partner were an unpassed hand, the choice of 3♦ would be much easier. There is too much chance that partner would jump in Spades. In turn, this makes 3♦ much more attractive.

As is, partner is passed hand significantly reducing the chance that partner will jump in Spades. Double works its way back into the picture.

Personally, I'm still going with 3♦. Swans play well in their long suit. More importantly, I'm worried about the auction

P - (2♣) - X - (3♣)
3♠ - (P) - ???

We're this to happen, I'll be end played into bidding 3N

[jillybean]

X crosses my mind here, I'd play 3nt if my partner shows ♠.. but I've been caught out before with these X's.

or..

2♦, hoping for a game in ♥'s.

jb

[mike777]

2D with a spade void I do not expect the bidding to die. Let's go slow and listen to the auction and decide what to do.

[pbleighton]

3D.

I love the weak 2 club opening

Peter

[Free]

2♦, I expect LHO to support, and then I can easily reverse in ♥. Btw, 2♦ should be forcing imo... With passed partner it might be better to use 3♦ as weak, but to endanger a 3NT contract from opps, since 2♦ is hardly interference and they get a cuebid.

[FrancesHinden]

3♦. Shows a good hand with long diamonds, which seems a fair description of what I've got.

[Fluffy]

Easy 2♦, a good hand with long diamonds.

[MickyB]

Easy 3♦, a better hand with long ♦

[P_Marlowe]

3D.

Marlowe

[Kalvan14]

3♦, wtp?
I'd never double with a chicane in ♠ and 2♦ is a bit timid

[whereagles]

Thanks all. This is the full hand:

Scoring: IMP

Pard RHO you
pass 2♣* ??

*weak 2 in clubs

---

Bidding some number of diamonds seems reasonable, but pard will pass regardless. Double works slightly better, since pard will probably bid to game after that. The problem is how to stop short of slam in that case. Still, no matter what action one chooses for this particular hand, that action may easily fail in another layout.

There's no simple solution to the problems caused by this seamingly "innocuous" 2♣ preempt.

[mike777]

whereagles, on Jan 9 2006, 07:53 AM, said:

Thanks all. This is the full hand: <!-- FULLHAND begin --><table border=1> <tr> <td> <table> <tr> <td>Dealer:</td> <td> North </td> </tr> <tr> <td>Vul:</td> <td> Both </td> </tr> <tr> <td>Scoring:</td> <td> IMP </td> </tr> </table> </td> <td> <table> <tr> <th> </th> <th> <table> <tr> <th class='spades'>♠</th> <td> A8763 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='hearts'>♥</th> <td> JT842 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='diamonds'>♦</th> <td>  </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='clubs'>♣</th> <td> 954 </td> </tr> </table> </th> <th> </th> </tr> <tr> <th> <table> <tr> <th class='spades'>♠</th> <td> QJT92 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='hearts'>♥</th> <td> K7 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='diamonds'>♦</th> <td> QT93 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='clubs'>♣</th> <td> A6 </td> </tr> </table> </th> <th> </th> <th> <table> <tr> <th class='spades'>♠</th> <td> K54 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='hearts'>♥</th> <td> 65 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='diamonds'>♦</th> <td> 65 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='clubs'>♣</th> <td> QJ8732 </td> </tr> </table> </th> </tr> <tr> <th> </th> <th> <table> <tr> <th class='spades'>♠</th> <td>  </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='hearts'>♥</th> <td> AQ93 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='diamonds'>♦</th> <td> AKJ8742 </td> </tr> <tr> <th class='clubs'>♣</th> <td> KT </td> </tr> </table> </th> <th> </th> </tr> </table> </td> <td> Pard RHO you
pass 2♣* ??

*weak 2 in clubs </td> </tr> </table><!-- FULLHAND end -->
Bidding some number of diamonds seems reasonable, but pard will pass regardless. Double works slightly better, since pard will probably bid to game after that. The problem is how to stop short of slam in that case. Still, no matter what action one chooses for this particular hand, that action may easily fail in another layout.

There's no simple solution to the problems caused by this seamingly "innocuous" 2♣ preempt.

Psychic bids are always tough to deal with.

This hand was not a standard Vulnerable second seat weak 2 bid in playing strength or overall suit quality.

[MickyB]

But it gave the opps a problem they couldn't cope with. What does that tell you?

[Free]

MickyB, on Jan 9 2006, 04:35 PM, said:

But it gave the opps a problem they couldn't cope with. What does that tell you?

It tells me they should start opening weak hands with 44+M 2♣, 2♦ or 2♥, whatever they prefer... Better to avoid problems than having to solve them

[hrothgar]

mike777, on Jan 9 2006, 06:15 PM, said:

Psychic bids are always tough to deal with.

This hand was not a standard Vulnerable second seat weak 2 bid in playing strength or overall suit quality.

Given the rarity of a natural / preemptive weak 2 in clubs, I finding it surprising that there is a standard definition for the bid....

[whereagles]

Free, on Jan 9 2006, 04:03 PM, said:

MickyB, on Jan 9 2006, 04:35 PM, said:

But it gave the opps a problem they couldn't cope with. What does that tell you?

It tells me they should start opening weak hands with 44+M 2♣, 2♦ or 2♥, whatever they prefer... Better to avoid problems than having to solve them

Maybe Ben can scrap up a 1♠ ZAR opener?

[pbleighton]

"Given the rarity of a natural / preemptive weak 2 in clubs, I finding it surprising that there is a standard definition for the bid.... "

Standard is as Standard does

Anyone who uses 2C as weak is very likely to be an aggressive preempter. This does NOT make the 2C bid on this deal a psyche.

Peter