To invite or not, and how
#1
Posted 2003-October-20, 09:50
K98x
xx
K9
K9xxx
bidding:
W N E S
P 1C P 1S
P 1NT P ?
What do you bid, if anything? If you invite, how would you invite and why...tyia.
Jef
Surrendering to existential truth is the beginning of enlightenment.
#2
Posted 2003-October-20, 10:01
When V on the other hand, you may not let game pass away. So I bid 2C checkback. And if that isn't standard knowledge, then I'd bid 2NT...
#3
Posted 2003-October-20, 10:02
Surrendering to existential truth is the beginning of enlightenment.
#4
Posted 2003-October-20, 10:06
Quote
xx
K9
K9xxx
bidding:
W N E S
P 1C P 1S
P 1NT P ?
What do you bid, if anything? If you invite, how would you invite and why...tyia.
Ok, Team match, so it is imps, but you didn't say if you were vulnerable or not. This is an important issue. At imps, you want to stretch to try to reach close game when vulnerable, but when not vul, you can bid more conservately. You really need to think such thoughts at the table.
Ok, so lets assume first you are not vulnerable. I would pass. End of story. Partner might have as much as 14 hcp, but everytime i go bidding here, I catch him with 12. And even when he has 14 hcp, you will not necessarily make 3NT.
Now, if I was vulnerable, I would have to make a game try. The two obvious gane tries are 2NT and 3C. But this hand looks balanced, so I would bid 2NT. I guess if partner is looking at 11, 12 or yucky 13 he will pass either 2NT or 3C. After all, at this vul, I would bid most CLOSE games without inviting. So when it goes 1C-1S; 1N-2N when we are vul, Partner KNOWS I am not looking at 11 or 12 hcp, or I would have taken a shot at 3NT myself (can't afford to miss games vul). This inference is even stronger with a jump to 3C I guess. But my choice here is 2NT if vulnerable.
Ben
#5
Posted 2003-October-20, 10:20
Pd held:
Txx
Qxx
Axx
AQTx
Jef
Surrendering to existential truth is the beginning of enlightenment.
#6
Posted 2003-October-20, 10:21
#7
Posted 2003-October-20, 10:24
Quote
Pd held:
Txx
Qxx
Axx
AQTx
Jef
pd should pass 3c, afterall, he is min. 3c is abosolutely correct. but if pd bid 3d, perhaps you should bid 3h to ask for the stopper in h.
#8
Posted 2003-October-20, 11:07
Chances for game even vulnerable are rare and the hand will play on clubs a lot better than in NT.
I'm tired to run a simulation but my instinct says that 3nt might make in about 15%-20% of the cases, certainly not enough 8/9 tricks in clubs should be the percentage bid.
#9
Posted 2003-October-20, 11:25
It certainly is close. If your partner opened some yucky 11 or 12, 2NT and 3C could well be one trick too high. If your partner has a meaty 14 and the fifth club is working, well.. game might work. So it is not the percentage of the time game makes, (say 20%) that is important. You have to weigh the percentage of the time it makes versus the percentage of time your game invite goes down one.... This makes bidding or inviting when vul very close indeed.
Ben
#10
Posted 2003-October-20, 11:30
Quote
It certainly is close. If your partner opened some yucky 11 or 12, 2NT and 3C could well be one trick too high. If your partner has a meaty 14 and the fifth club is working, well.. game might work. So it is not the percentage of the time game makes, (say 20%) that is important. You have to weigh the percentage of the time it makes versus the percentage of time your game invite goes down one.... This makes bidding or inviting when vul very close indeed.
Ben
I don't think it's worth the try because you have to try for a game in NT while your best denomination is clubs. That's why this is probable not worth the risk even 1NT can go down with 8/9 tricks in clubs, so bidding 2NT to go down 1/2/3 in 2NT or go down 1/2/3 in 3NT is not sound because you'd probably be +something in 2c.
#11
Posted 2003-October-20, 13:04
Quote
K98x
xx
K9
K9xxx
bidding:
W N E S
P 1C P 1S
P 1NT P ?
What do you bid, if anything? If you invite, how would you invite and why...tyia.
Jef
If partner had opened a weak NT I would have passed without giving it a second thought. I don't think the club fit (which may only be 8 cards) is enough to change my bid.
Eric
#12
Posted 2003-October-20, 14:13
Quote
Quote
K98x
xx
K9
K9xxx
bidding:
W N E S
P 1C P 1S
P 1NT P ?
What do you bid, if anything? If you invite, how would you invite and why...tyia.
Jef
If partner had opened a weak NT I would have passed without giving it a second thought. I don't think the club fit (which may only be 8 cards) is enough to change my bid.
Eric
Yes it's different than a weak NT opening. Now you have the option to play 2c that is a lot better than 1NT :-)
Luis
#13
Posted 2003-October-20, 19:36
#14
Posted 2003-October-21, 04:16
#15
Posted 2003-October-21, 06:39
If you play modern limit of 14-16 1NT opening, 1NT rebid will be 11-13 and no need to invite with such hand. In case of 11-14 rebid, it is still not good for inv hand, because lack of QT. Examples of good hand same hcp for inv: AQxx-xx-xx-Kxxxx or xxxx-xx-Ax-KQxxx
NT or CL contract? We have CL fit, opp probably too. I expect they have DI fit because no take out dbls. You have K DI, no A - NT contract is probably better.
Misho
#16
Posted 2003-October-24, 17:43
23 points where are the 9 tricks coming from, OK, playing against me, defensive errors, but in any game of a reasonable standard pass 1NT. We in the club R trying to improve so Pass, the 1 time in 50 you make 3NT will never get back the points you lose on the other 49 hands.
IMHO
Reginald F
#17
Posted 2003-November-02, 01:07
quote author=billyjef link=board=5;threadid=1250;start=0#msg7808 date=1066665026]
In a team match yesterday with some fellow B/Iers, sitting south, I was dealt this hand:
K98x
xx
K9
K9xxx
bidding:
W N E S
P 1C P 1S
P 1NT P ?
What do you bid, if anything? If you invite, how would you invite and why...tyia.
Jef
Quote