[Jinksy]

---

You're dealer, love all at MPs.

What minimal change would it take to shift you in favour of the closest alternative?

(Edited to add) If relevant to your decision, we were playing 5cMs, weak NT, 2/1 is non-GF.

[ArtK78]

Either 3♠ or 4♠, depending on the mood that I am in. I don't think there is much to choose between either choice.

Not 1♠. Other than the ♥A you have absolutely no defense.

[CSGibson]

1♠. You have two first round controls outside of your suit, and a defensive honor in the 3rd suit, so I don't like preempting because partner will not evaluate easily the types of hands needed to go to game. At the same time, I think pass is also a misdescription of your hand, which leaves 1♠ as the least bad option in my opinion.

Even shift one of the side suits to the void, making it 7-3-1-2 or 7-2-1-3, and I would open 3. I think it is incredibly close, and I wouldn't fault someone who made a different choice than I made - I think that when you post a borderline hand, there is room on both sides of the border, and this is clearly borderline.

This post has been edited by CSGibson: 2013-October-30, 13:09

[Lord Molyb]

pass

[gszes]

virtually no defense a decent 1 suited hand seems like a great recipe for a
preempt and the little extra surpise void gives the hand a bit more offensive
punch making it worthwhile to try 4s right away. The number of hands where
another suit will work better is probably under 15% and with only top spades
missing a penalty x is unlikely might as well go for the gusto. Hate the idea of
opening something like this 1s since any competitive bidding will leave p with
no clue how to ever proceed when you open hands like this at 1 level. With


At MP note the difference btn being VUL and NVUL at even
equal vulnerability (NVUL)
4s=8 3s=6 2s=4 1s=3 pass=2
equal vulnerability (VUL)
3s=9 4s=7 2s=5 1s=3 pass=2

vulnerability plays a HUGE role in these types of hands

at unfavorable
3s=8 2s=6 4s=4 1s=3 pass=2

at favorable
4s=10 3s=7 2s=4 1s=3 pass=2

[P_Marlowe]

With my standard partner I would pass, on somedays open with 3S.

We have fairly well defined agreements regarding preempts in 1st / 2nd,
and the hand is too weak for 4S, and not really suitable for a 3S preempt,
due to the distributes values.

We will get in later. Given that we have the spades, there is no need to hurry
with regards to preempt them.

Assuming we would have hearts instead of spades, I am leaning more towards
a direct opening, maybe even towards 4H.

With a pickup partner I would go with 4S.

I dont like 1S.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Cyberyeti]

ArtK78, on 2013-October-30, 11:33, said:

Either 3♠ or 4♠, depending on the mood that I am in. I don't think there is much to choose between either choice.

Not 1♠. Other than the ♥A you have absolutely no defense.

I utterly disagree with this assessment of the defence, partner has say ♥J10, ♣K10 which looks like some defence but not much and suddenly you have 4 tricks. The 9s are actually potentially quite big cards.

This hand is rule of 19 with a bit to spare, QJ10 is undervalued at 3 points, I'd probably open 1 with a small spade fewer and one of the side suit 9s being a 10, so am quite happy doing so here. Partner certainly won't expect me to be this good if I open 3, and I don't fancy 4 which could really fix partner (he has one of x, KQx, AKJxxxx, xx or the same with the minors reversed for example).

[ArtK78]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-October-30, 12:55, said:

This hand is rule of 19 with a bit to spare.

What is the Rule of 19? Seems like we are going beyond the Rule of 20 (which is a somewhat silly rule of thumb in any event, but now being extended downward to 19).

[Cyberyeti]

ArtK78, on 2013-October-30, 12:58, said:

What is the Rule of 19? Seems like we are going beyond the Rule of 20 (which is a somewhat silly rule of thumb in any event, but now being extended downward to 19).

Rule of 19 was the limit of what you were allowed to agree to open in the UK for a while (and we open all unbalanced Ro19 hands that don't have a reason to downvalue), I'd argue this hand with all its intermediates is in the spirit of Ro20 anyway.

[jogs]

4♠. Will not bid again unless forced.

[mike777]

1s
no problem yet.


make the a of h the K or less and I open 3s.

[Lord Molyb]

mike777, on 2013-October-30, 18:36, said:

1s
no problem yet.


make the a of h the K or less and I open 3s.

apparently there is a problem because there are more people not opening 1♠ than people opening 1♠

[the hog]

Either 3Sor Pass, depending on partnership agreement. Definitely NOT 1S.

[cherdano]

the hog, on 2013-October-30, 19:44, said:

Either 3Sor Pass, depending on partnership agreement. Definitely NOT 1S.

I am fine with 1S or 4S. I absolutely hate 3S (how on earth is partner supposed to judge when to bid 4S?) and pass.

[the hog]

cherdano, on 2013-October-30, 20:02, said:

I am fine with 1S or 4S. I absolutely hate 3S (how on earth is partner supposed to judge when to bid 4S?) and pass.

I would accept 1S ONLY if playing a LOB system. I could just as easily ask you, "How on earth is partner supposed to know not to make a 2/1 on what he considers min gf values?"
Arend, I consider your answer in the 2 handed approach rather than the 4 handed. You seem to forget that a 3S bid may well make life difficult for the opponents,

[dake50]

"Assuming we would have hearts instead of spades, I am leaning more towards
a direct opening, maybe even towards 4H." -- Marlowe

*** Exactly. With HAxx + void, we may set 4H OR bid spades at the same level.
Switch majors and much more to obstruct their 4S.
Can't overbid at the same level or decide to defend, must go a level higher.
I like 3S with the 'Lightner' double option to 4H:
D-ruff + Suit prefer back + D-ruff-2nd + HA looks doable IF partner sits - 4S if not.

[dake50]

"Assuming we would have hearts instead of spades, I am leaning more towards
a direct opening, maybe even towards 4H." -- Marlowe

*** Exactly. With HAxx + void, we may set 4H OR bid spades at the same level.
Switch majors and much more to obstruct their 4S.
Can't overbid at the same level or decide to defend, must go a level higher.
I like 3S with the 'Lightner' double option to 4H:
D-ruff + Suit prefer back + D-ruff-2nd + HA looks doable IF partner sits - 4S if not.

[MrAce]

Cherdano said what i wanted to say. I really do not mind 1-3-4 ♠ but i personally prefer 1 or 4 ♠

[Fluffy]

I'd open 3♠, switch the majors and I would open 4♥

[gnasher]

I'd open 4♠, but I don't mind 1♠. I dislike 3♠, because it understates both the defensive values and the offensive strength.

If you turned ♠10 into ♠2 I'd have no idea what to do.