[Phil]

All vul, dealer

Q9x AJ7xxx Qx Jx

2H - 2N
?

Thanks.

[jjbrr]

Excellent thread title.
I'd call this bad trumps, good hand but I think it's close to bad hand.

[hanp]

If not this, then how much stronger is a good hand with a bad suit?

I don't understand how one could sell a 10-count as a bad hand with a bad suit.

[ONEferBRID]

hanp, on Mar 19 2010, 04:23 PM, said:

If not this, then how much stronger is a good hand with a bad suit?

I don't understand how one could sell a 10-count as a bad hand with a bad suit.

Bad hand = 8 loser
Good hand = 7 loser

Bad suit = 1 of top 3 honors
Good suit = 2 of top 3 honors

Q9x  AJ7xxx  Qx  Jx = 8 loser hand

KQx  AJ7xxx  xx  xx = 7 loser ( Good hand )

[cherdanno]

Another proof that loser count is a waste of time?
I also don't understand how this is not a maximum.

[mohitz]

obv 3H

[MFA]

3♥. No reason to make a problem out of this. Our Q, Q, J will often mesh well with partner's values.

[Phil]

MFA, on Mar 20 2010, 03:47 AM, said:

3♥. No reason to make a problem out of this. Our Q, Q, J will often mesh well with partner's values.

I bid 3H and didn't think too much of it but I was maligned by one pair of teammates for doing so. Agree this 'junk' might be useful to partner in 3N.

This bad suit / good hand classification could be a lot better: xx AJxxxx KQx xx f/i.

[aguahombre]

Are there really people on BBO fora who would not open 1H with 6-3-2-2 hand which includes a KQX and AJXXXX? Those example hands are not possible.

[MarkDean]

aguahombre, on Mar 20 2010, 10:09 AM, said:

Are there really people on BBO fora who would not open 1H with 6-3-2-2 hand which includes a KQX and AJXXXX? Those example hands are not possible.

I cannot speak to if there are "people," but I am sure there is "person."

[aguahombre]

MarkDean, on Mar 20 2010, 11:25 AM, said:

aguahombre, on Mar 20 2010, 10:09 AM, said:

Are there really people on BBO fora who would not open 1H with 6-3-2-2 hand which includes a KQX and AJXXXX? Those example hands are not possible.

I cannot speak to if there are "people," but I am sure there is "person."

Hey, that's cool. I was actually more making an observation that there are a whole bunch on this site who have advocated strongly a 1-bid with much weaker hands. Perhaps I exaggerated.

edit: the people who voted to pass the given OP hand originally or said they would have opened a 1-bid on this junk should probably be considered to be extra votes for 3H on the OP question about rebid after 2NT.

[neilkaz]

MFA, on Mar 20 2010, 02:47 AM, said:

3♥. No reason to make a problem out of this. Our Q, Q, J will often mesh well with partner's values.

My thoughts exactly

[jdonn]

3♥ is one of the easiest bids on the forums in recent times. You have 10 points and have no idea where partner's values are. Why can't he have 17 and just be looking for enough values for game? This is a real no-brainer.

[Phil]

aguahombre, on Mar 20 2010, 12:09 PM, said:

Are there really people on BBO fora who would not open 1H with 6-3-2-2 hand which includes a KQX and AJXXXX? Those example hands are not possible.

Lots of us. I think 1H can be dangerous in a 2/1 setting.

At least I know Hrothgar and Mike777 agree .

[aguahombre]

Us mistaken souls who like a different suit quality for first seat vul, and hate passing the hand, might open a one-bid with KQX AJXXXX XX XX. I am an old guy who likes the opening bids to be halfway decent, but I have seen a lot worse with 13 HCP.

[ArtK78]

I use loser count in evaluating hand strength more than almost anyone on this Forum. And I think this is a 3♥ bid.

Partner is supposed to have a good hand for his 2NT bid. My hand will not be a disappointment to him.

[nige1]

Phil, on Mar 19 2010, 03:47 PM, said:

All vul, dealer Q9x AJ7xxx Qx Jx

IMO 1♥ = 10, 2♥ = 6, _P = 3, 3♥ = 1.
Vulnerable, with opening values but a flimsy suit, 1♥ seems a better option than a pre-empt

Phil, on Mar 19 2010, 03:47 PM, said:

2♥ - 2N - ??

Now 3♥ = 10, 3♣ = 3

[neilkaz]

at calling this hand opening values with Qx and Jx in minors and 10 HCP.

KNR says 9.45. I wouldn't dream to open 1 here unless playing forcing club with opening 1's being 10-15 and then only since I have a 6 carder.

Just my opinion that this is far from an opening 1 bid in a S/A system.

[gwnn]

It is my simplistic and overly optimistic approach to open most 10 counts with a 6 card suit on the 1 level. It is not just a question of getting possibly too high etc, it's also the question of what else one can do (passing is risky, we may not be sufficiently hearts-oriented for a weak 2). I do agree that this does not look like a good weak 2 but that's just because it does not look like a weak 2 at all. But if I opened 2H with this I have to bid 3H now.

[dake50]

Partner asking! Now 'junk' likely useful at least mostly. Bad(<2 tops), Good hand.