[Phil]

Matchpoints, None vul

AJ xx AKQJxxx xx

(1♥) - 3♥ - (pass) - 3♠
(pass) - ?

Do you agree with 3♥?

What is 3♠?

[Hanoi5]

4♦. Partner doesn't have the stopper but is offering spades as a possibility. I don't like'em.

[nigel_k]

 Hanoi5, on 2013-June-24, 21:31, said:

4♦. Partner doesn't have the stopper but is offering spades as a possibility. I don't like'em.

4♠. Partner doesn't have the stopper but is offering spades as a possibility. I do like'em.

For example: KQxxxx xx xx KQx. Introducing a worse spade than that into this kind of auction would be unlikely and we could still survive even so. If his side suits are worse maybe 4♦ also doesn't make.

[rhm]

 nigel_k, on 2013-June-25, 01:12, said:

4♠. Partner doesn't have the stopper but is offering spades as a possibility. I do like'em.

For example: KQxxxx xx xx KQx. Introducing a worse spade than that into this kind of auction would be unlikely and we could still survive even so. If his side suits are worse maybe 4♦ also doesn't make.

There are several issues here:

1) Why should 3♥ be confined to solid minors? With a solid major and a heart stopper in partner's hand there may well be as many tricks in notrumps than in the major and this number may be nine.
2) What is partner's default bid lacking a heart stopper without a good suit? What the cheapest suit bid (3♠) shows seems to me a matter of agreement. I am not sure how to interpret it,

Rainer Herrmann

[Phil]

Without discussion the standard here is to play 3x as a solid minor so let's assume that.

[wyman]

I don't like having solid majors in the 3H range, so I think 3S=spades, since 3S="can you bid 3N with a half stopper" seems not nearly as useful. So I'd bid 4S. We can always get out at 5m later if I'm wrong and partner scrambles. But this is a good discussion to have with partner -- there are a few issues involved here.

[Fluffy]

4♠ looks like an awful contract even when partner has the nuts ♠KQ ♣A we haven't yet made it.

I would bid 4♦.

[Hanoi5]

I have never discussed this with anyone but holding two hearts (and not hearing them showing support) and two clubs I'm concerned about four quick losers or even dummy being tapped in hearts and partner losing communications in diamonds.

[the hog]

4D. Partner has 5S. I do not think 4S will be a good contract.

[MrAce]

 Phil, on 2013-June-24, 21:07, said:

What is 3♠?

 Phil, on 2013-June-25, 09:14, said:

Without discussion the standard here is to play 3x as a solid minor so let's assume that.

Then why are you asking the question ? Am i missing something ?

[nige1]

 Phil, on 2013-June-24, 21:07, said:

Matchpoints, None vul ♠ A J ♥ x x ♦ A K Q J x x x ♣ x x
(1♥) - 3♥ - (pass) - 3♠
(pass) - ?
Do you agree with 3♥?
What is 3♠?

IMO

• Agree with 3♥ asking for a ♥ stopper in the first instance, with interest in 3N or better things (usually a strong hand with a near solid suit).
• Partner's 3♠ = Negative no ♥ stop and a poor hand. (3N would have shown a ♥ stop. Other bids deny a ♥ stop but show values).
• Now 4♦ = Natural, nothing to spare.

[Phil]

 MrAce, on 2013-June-25, 17:59, said:

Then why are you asking the question ? Am i missing something ?

Because Rainer implied that 3♥ could contain any solid suit and not just minors. If thats the case, 3♠ might just mean pass/correct.

[MrAce]

 Phil, on 2013-June-25, 22:16, said:

Because Rainer implied that 3♥ could contain any solid suit and not just minors. If thats the case, 3♠ might just mean pass/correct.

Yea i know but you said that w/o agreement it should be solid minor, if so ( you said it ) then 3♠ can be only natural, no ? You asked what 3♠ means, and all i am saying is what it means depends on strictly what 3♥ was.

[Zelandakh]

 MrAce, on 2013-June-26, 02:57, said:

Yea i know but you said that w/o agreement it should be solid minor, if so ( you said it ) then 3♠ can be only natural, no ?

No, while that is the default meaning, it is also logical to bid this with half a stopper should you have the agreement to do so. Over 3♠ I will bid 4♦; there is nothing stopping partner from repeating spades now if they feel so inclined.

[MrAce]

 Zelandakh, on 2013-June-26, 03:03, said:

No, while that is the default meaning, it is also logical to bid this with half a stopper should you have the agreement to do so. Over 3♠ I will bid 4♦; there is nothing stopping partner from repeating spades now if they feel so inclined.

Perhaps.

In fact it may be a better idea since 3♥ bidder is much more interested in how good/bad we will do in 3NT, rather than our 5-6 card spades. Gotcha !

[cherdano]

I made a multi-meaning bid. Partner made the cheapest possible bid. Ergo: may be a punt.

[Phil]

I can tell you this partner is pretty experienced, and very much down-the-middle. However, I do not think he gets a lot of the modern concepts, as you can surmise in some of the other posts. Part of winning bridge is to be able to correctly interpret what calls mean through your partner's eyes, rather that what they should be.

I doubt 3♠ here means anything but spades. Unfortunately we do not have a good landing place since partner has T9xxxx of spades and not much more. He did have ♥Qxx, but RHO is definitely good enough to lead a club from her AKxx instead of leading a low heart from AKxxx.

The main question to me assuming 3♠ is natural, should it be forcing? I thought it was and I raised to 4♠. RHO did hammer this and it was -500.

[benlessard]

What is best depend on if you may have a half stopper for 3H, if you do I think 3S should denies spades while 4c should show 5S(Forcing),I dont know anybody who play this way but I think its better because it allow to get to good 3nt at the cost of 3S being forcing.

if not than I think 3S should be NF because advancer can bid 4H as COG instead (not really important to have 4H has splinter here. Im also wondering if you play 4m who do you prefer to play the hand ? I think i prefer to disclose avdancer rather than overcaller but im not sure (easier for defense to switch when you see the stiff on dummy)

But with no discussion I would assume that 3S is NF and 4H is COG.

[PhilKing]

4♥ PAG.

Partner's 3♠ shows, of all things, spades and a reasonable hand, so it's time to wheel out the dreaded pick a game cue bid. 4♥ by partner would have shown a slam try and a control - it's not pick a game, since he by-passed 3♠.

[MrAce]

 PhilKing, on 2013-June-30, 10:36, said:

4♥ PAG.

Partner's 3♠ shows, of all things, spades and a reasonable hand, so it's time to wheel out the dreaded pick a game cue bid. 4♥ by partner would have shown a slam try and a control - it's not pick a game, since he by-passed 3♠.

If pd is showing spades and a reasonable hand, why are we still asking him to choose ? Don't we have a decent support ? With nothing else in other suits ? And pd already knows we have a solid minor.

Even if we are confident that 4♥ will be recieved by pd as COG, it would be more suitable with hands like J xx AKQJxxx Axx or xx xx AKQJxxx Ax imo. If he is bidding 3♠ with only 5, is it too much to expect him to hold KQxxx or even KQTxx ?

Perhaps i am thinking way too simple but if 3♠ showing spades and a reasonable hand, i am bidding 4♠.