[wank]

i saw this recently at my table when i got dragged along to the bridge club....so ridiculous it was funny.

the contract was 2S and the player's partner led the ace of clubs (A from AK asking for standard count) and dummy puts down QJxx. The player has xxxx. how to signal?

your partner is bottom 1/4 club player. if you peter (whichever pip you play), there's a big chance partner will continue the king trying to give you a ruff, setting up dummy's QJ, and in doing so, the king might well get ruffed down too. not petering and giving false count to encourage a switch would be a little too advanced for this player (probably slightly above average club player himself), so what should he do?

giving a slow peter is perhaps the standard technique for players of this calibre, but this guy did way better. he took his 9 non-clubs and put them face down on the table and was perforce left with a hand of 4 cards, which he then fanned very widely and then followed suit.

his partner blithely continued with the king which got ruffed.

no, before you jump to it, she wasn't 'doing the ethical thing' and punishing him for his naughty ways. she was entirely blind to the whole by-play.

for extra irony, as the guy had sat down at our table for the start of the round, he had with all seriousness, put his hands together in prayer position and bid us 'namaste', the Hindu greeting (according to wikipedia, "It expresses politeness, courtesy, honour, and hospitality from one person to the other").

[kuhchung]

i can't stop laughing

[ggwhiz]

Hehe. Classic!

Your description seems to confirm that if the Director wants to poll, they have peers and that's frightening.

[661_Pete]

At least you can't do that online!

I've often wondered about how easy it is to give inadvertant UI in live play. For instance, at the end of bidding, I follow usual practice in transferring the trump suit to the left-hand side of my hand. If partner watches carefully, they might spot how many trumps I'm holding. On the other hand, it's more likely to be useful information for declarer than partner, if they happen to be looking! So I've tried to get into the habit of concealing my cards under the table, while I do this....

[sfi]

661_Pete, on 2016-June-17, 06:45, said:

At least you can't do that online!

I've often wondered about how easy it is to give inadvertant UI in live play. For instance, at the end of bidding, I follow usual practice in transferring the trump suit to the left-hand side of my hand.

That's hardly usual practice, and anything like that is well worth trying to break.

[661_Pete]

sfi, on 2016-June-17, 07:13, said:

That's hardly usual practice, and anything like that is well worth trying to break.

Maybe. When one gets older one sometimes needs little reminders. Anyway, the BBO software does it.

[Vampyr]

Fine, move your cards around under the level of the table, but why do it at all?

[kenberg]

Many years ago, but I still remember it, I was at a tournament where Dot Lewis had a table selling bridge books. A guy was asking her about books on signalling and I said "Playing a card quickly shows attitude, playing it slowly gives count and may be suit preference". Dot is a very easy going person but she literally screamed at me "Do not say that, not even joking, he is a beginner!" . But separating the cards into clubs and non-clubs is a real innovation.

Of course I apologized, but from the conversation I did not think he was all that much of a beginner and I am pretty sure (?) he knew I was joking.

[Vampyr]

Playing against Jan Jansma I once had a slam auction where I was asked for specific kings. My outside K was in spades, but unfortunately our suit was hearts, so I signed off in 6. I commented afterwards about being unable to show my King, and Jan suggested, "just bid 6♥ slowly. That's what we do". It was so funny.

If any inexperienced players are reading this: YES he was joking.

[maartenxq]

Vampyr, on 2016-June-17, 17:20, said:

Playing against Jan Jansma I once had a slam auction where I was asked for specific kings. My outside K was in spades, but unfortunately our suit was hearts, so I signed off in 6. I commented afterwards about being unable to show my King, and Jan suggested, "just bid 6♥ slowly. That's what we do". It was so funny.

If any inexperienced players are reading this: YES he was joking.

Years ago I used to play rubber bridge and team matches for money in mixed company. Not for tremendous stakes by the way. One of the more experienced players, who shall remain nameless, explained once to me: if I double slowly in competitive bidding my thinking prevents you ethically from taking out my double, so these doubles are for penalty.

Come to think of it, I remember having read an interview of Hans Kreijns, dutch top player in the 60's and former world champ, telling of his matches against the Blue team, who were signaling odd even. 'This gives a problem when holding only odd cards and wanting to sign off. I cannot say they were very obvious about it, but I have witnessed several times an ever so slight pause and then partner duly switched.' In Kreijns' opinion this was legitimate partner understanding and he firmly denied all rumors of Italian cheating etc., apart from the famous tap dancers in Bermuda.

[ggwhiz]

Vampyr, on 2016-June-17, 17:20, said:

Playing against Jan Jansma I once had a slam auction where I was asked for specific kings. My outside K was in spades, but unfortunately our suit was hearts, so I signed off in 6. I commented afterwards about being unable to show my King, and Jan suggested, "just bid 6♥ slowly. That's what we do". It was so funny.

If any inexperienced players are reading this: YES he was joking.

The Spanish team in the Albuquerque Rosenblum did this exact thing to my teammates with clubs as trumps and a slow signoff with a higher ranking king, raised to the grand. They appealed the rollback and the committee very politely took a full 4 minutes before scooping the deposit.

I would wager that Jan was joking as far as himself but had seen it done.

[661_Pete]

I suppose the next question is - can Bridge ever be made completely cheat-free?

I think not. At least, not unless playing with robots. There are so many ways in which little snippets of UI can leak out.

But is it unethical to take advantage of an opponent's unwitting disclosure? I'm sure everyone's experienced the time-honoured finesse scenario: lead a high card, then notice LHO's hesitation before not covering it.

On BBO, however, this strategy is often stymied by the software imposing a random delay when a player's using the 'auto-play-singleton' option (I don't like that option, I haven't enabled it for myself). In fact, I have sometimes successfully placed an opponent with a singleton by taking note of that artificial-looking delay.

Any thoughts about that last?

[gszes]

interesting greeting =- I guess it means he is hoping how YOU will act since his obvious cheat was anything but "namaste"

[Vampyr]

maartenxq, on 2016-June-18, 07:51, said:

Years ago I used to play rubber bridge and team matches for money in mixed company. Not for tremendous stakes by the way. One of the more experienced players, who shall remain nameless, explained once to me: if I double slowly in competitive bidding my thinking prevents you ethically from taking out my double, so these doubles are for penalty.

Once I was playing against two older women had obviously heard of ethics but didn't quite understand what it meant. During the course of the auction a slow double was made which was taken out by the other woman. At the end of the hand the doubler remarked in a frustrated tone,"but I hesitated!"